 |
O’Reilly, Ingraham: Saying That U.S. Tortures Is ‘One Of The Most Hateful Stereotypes About America’
Think Progress
Saturday, July 26, 2008
Last night on the O’Reilly Factor, host Bill O’Reilly and guest Laura Ingraham slammed Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL) for declaring in Berlin yesterday that the U.S. will “reject torture and stand for the rule of law.” “Enough is enough with this torture nonsense,” O’Reilly whined, declaring it “rank anti-American propaganda” to claim the U.S. has tortured people.
Ingraham agreed, calling the claim “ridiculous.” She was furious he mentioned torture while abroad:
INGRAHAM: He got up there in front of 200,000 people and he glommed on to one of the most ridiculous and one of the hateful stereotypes about America, which is that we torture. The fact that he did that on foreign soil I think is absolutely atrocious.
O’REILLY: I pointed it out and I feel the way you do. He should absolutely not mention — that’s ridiculous.
IGRAHAM: I mean, come on! That was torture, thank you very much.
Watch it:
(Article continues below)
It is ironic that O’Reilly and Ingraham dismissed claims of torture as a “ridiculous” “stereotype” and “rank anti-American propaganda” yesterday, when just hours before broadcast, the ACLU had released yet another White House legal memo that specifically authorized torture of detainees. The 2002 memo describes a “loophole” determining that torture is only illegal if the interrogator has a “specific intent” to cause severe pain.
In fact, the memo’s author, Jay Bybee, declared that as long as an interrogator acted with a “good faith belief” that his actions would not cause torturous pain and suffering, he has not violated the law. What’s more, Bybee wrote, “an honest belief need not be reasonable.”
O’Reilly’s own views on torture notwithstanding, it’s clear that torture constituted the express policy of the Bush administration — and whether Obama discusses it or not won’t change that fact.
Prison
Planet.tv Members Can Watch
Fall Of The Republic
Right Now Online -
Don't Miss Out! Get
Your Subscription Today!
CANCER CONSPIRACY? Are
"they" suppressing the cure? Will YOU
be the next victim? Learn
the Secret Truth! - READ FULL STORY
-
- Social bookmarks
- Email this article
-
- Print this page
84 Responses to “O’Reilly, Ingraham: Saying That U.S. Tortures Is ‘One Of The Most Hateful Stereotypes About America’”
 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | |||||||
| By N2H | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
July 26th, 2008 at 6:14 am
I’ve just had a meeting in hell and ordered some of the devils to prepare for the due arrival of Bill O’Reilly and Laura Ingraham. We have a special Fox news section here in Gehenna. They have told me that they are very willing and ready to teach Bill and Laura a very painful lesson about the exact consequences and effects of torture. We believe in the positive effects of the learning from experience method.
July 26th, 2008 at 6:41 am
“Faux News.”
That says it all.
It has been my observation that the talking heads on FN seem to be among the very worst dregs that humanity has had the misfortune to spawn. Not a single one of them is worthy of even the slightest shred of respect. All of them seem quite mentally ill.
July 26th, 2008 at 7:13 am
Just hearing the name “Bill O’Reilly” evokes the mental pains and anguish of torture
July 26th, 2008 at 9:52 am
Brad Snyder, it seems you should be employed at FOX News since your research skills dont even extend as far as to a 5 second search on your computer for stories of torture. Torturing of detainees has HAPPENED, and these detainees that have been tortured, as you call “animals” have not even been CHARGED with any crimes. If you would like PROOF, here you go:
http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/06/.....index.html
If there is no torture, then why did Congress just approve of a bill that would CONTINUE torturing—-a bill that John McCain SUPPORTED!
July 26th, 2008 at 10:41 am
Larry, if we were NOT treating enemy combatants with a high level of discomfort I would wonder why not. You want to give them the rights of American citizens and tuck them in bed with a milk and cookie. You don’t know my level of research. I would suggest you address things that that you have a little more knowledge than the indoctrination you are fed from CNN.
July 26th, 2008 at 11:24 am
Blind leaders of the blind.
July 26th, 2008 at 11:50 am
Doesn’t O’Reilly claim to be a Christian? Didn’t Jesus say that we should treat others as we wish to be treated ourselves? And didn’t Jesus say that the way we treated the least important people in the world was the way we treated Him? Didn’t Jesus say that we should trust God to care for us and that we didn’t need to worry for our security, that God would care for us? Wasn’t the lesson of Job that we should trust God, even when things are really scary or when things seem to go really bad, that God knows what is best for us and will reward our faith in the end?
The world would be a much happier and safer place if those who claim to be Christians would simply make an effort to follow the teachings of Jesus. A whole host of American “Christians” will be very surprised on Judgement Day when Jesus says, “I don’t know you, when I was in peril, you turned your back on me and said I was an animal that deserved the worst treatment possible. You can spend eternity with the Lord of Darkness, whom you have served so well in your lifetime.”
July 26th, 2008 at 12:02 pm
FOX SNOOZE…Misinformation sleepy Sheeple depend on to make the world go around them…I could lull myself to sleep counting ALL Bully O I Lie so much O’Reilly LIES.
July 26th, 2008 at 12:08 pm
Brad Snyder, here is some more information about what you publicly support as justifiable. You better hope that you’ll never be at the receiving end of such disgusting, terrible, inhuman and pointless crimes. It is my firm believe that in the end much will be forgiven, but those who torture others or are complicit (lawyers, psychologists, politicians) surely will reap what they sow.
When beaten, he repeatedly cried “Allah!” The outcry appears to have amused U.S. military personnel, as the act of striking him in order to provoke a scream of “Allah!” eventually “became a kind of running joke,” according to one of the MP’s. “People kept showing up to give this detainee a common peroneal strike just to hear him scream out ‘Allah,’” he said. “It went on over a 24-hour period, and I would think that it was over 100 strikes.”
The Times reported that:
On the day of his death, Dilawar had been chained by the wrists to the top of his cell for much of the previous four days.
“A guard tried to force the young man to his knees. But his legs, which had been pummeled by guards for several days, could no longer bend. An interrogator told Mr. Dilawar that he could see a doctor after they finished with him. When he was finally sent back to his cell, though, the guards were instructed only to chain the prisoner back to the ceiling.
“Leave him up,” one of the guards quoted Specialist Claus as saying. Several hours passed before an emergency room doctor finally saw Mr. Dilawar. By then he was dead, his body beginning to stiffen.
Bagram torture and prisoner abuse
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B.....oner_abuse
Abu Ghraib torture and prisoner abuse
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A.....oner_abuse
July 26th, 2008 at 12:43 pm
Torture of prisoners by US troops and CIA goes WAAAY back. In 1966 I watched films of US troops waterboarding Viet Cong prisoners, and of other US troops wearing necklasses made of Viet Cong ears.
July 26th, 2008 at 12:48 pm
Doug:
Judaism and Christianity are the CHIEF CAUSE of US Imperialism,
militarism, and fascism. If and when it comes down to a fight,
synagogues, churches, and their assets will be PRIORITY TARGETS of the Revolutionary Freedom Fighters. Zionist Jews and Christians will not be welcome in the post-Revolutionary America, and Christian zealots will not be tolerated. This must happen, or our Revolutionary struggle for freedom and justice will have been a waste of time.
After the Revolution, there will be no place in the new America for Zionists. Period. Travel to and from Israel must be banned; anyone with an Israeli stamp in their passport must be expelled from the US or not allowed to enter in the first place. Plus all the synagogues must be closed and their assets confiscated. If the American Jews don’t like it, tell them where they can go. Agitation by Jews or Christians for their ‘rights’ should be punished with immediate deportation with no right of return, as well as confiscation of all their property of every kind.
July 26th, 2008 at 1:49 pm
I have a good idea-let`s take these O`reilly and Igraham scumbags (and all the other bush terrorists), send them off to Guantanamo Bay and waterboard them. Now that would be taxpayer money well spent!
One day Americans will learn the hard way that what goes around comes around. One day everything comes full circle.
July 26th, 2008 at 2:15 pm
Gregory you said “Judaism and Christianity are the CHIEF CAUSE of US Imperialism, militarism, and fascism” But unfortunately you are simply wrong. Judaism is not Zionism and Christianity is not the Marine Corp. Just because fake Christians promote these things does not mean that real Christians or better yet Christ promotes these things.
Then you said “Zionist Jews and Christians will not be welcome in the post-Revolutionary America, and Christian zealots will not be tolerated” wow you are right on track with the new world order. I can’t tell if your talking about a revolution by the people or if you are refering to the economic collapse orchestrated by the NWO. This country was founded by Christians on Christian values so maybe its you who should find another country to live in. Your ignorant intolerance of others personal beliefs has no place in a free and open society, so if thats your idea of a revolution then please for the sake of freedom loving people everywhere just stay at home. You sound like a Nazi!
July 26th, 2008 at 3:20 pm
Luke and really..the rest of you…Before we were ever accused of “torture”..I recall Fox reporting a number of beheadings; or have you forgotten. I’m quite certain the Bush haters among you would say 1. those butcherers are men we can negotiate with… and 2. they were not Muslim terrorists at all. They were the evil Zionist and their puppets George Bush and Dick Chaney. Couldn’t be the lovable Muslim puppies because they are a religion of peace, don’t you know. I don’t dislike Muslims by the way…I just really don’t like the particular ones that are killing our soldiers and want to destroy my way of life. To these people… as the country singer put it, I want to put a boot up their ass… Ohhh… but that would be torture…
July 26th, 2008 at 3:37 pm
The only ones killing our soldiers are the people of Iraq; which WE have invaded. You would do the same thing if Iraq INVADED us. So please stop bring that up. Also WE DO turture and O’Reilly is THE biggest MORON on the face of the earth. I hate that man with a passion and I can’t even stand hearing his voice. Why can’t he EVER get anything right ? I know he’s a NEOCON, NWO slut bag whore and one day when they are finished with him they’ll think of something really nice to do to him and that brings me great joy. All devil worshipers and minions will get what they deserve and again, that brings me joy.
July 26th, 2008 at 3:55 pm
Maria, Maria… Careful there sweetheart…Don’t want you to burst a blood vessel, causing a nose bleed or…something. You people simply amaze me… Sticking up for the enemy…defending them… And you wonder why we call you Un-American? Is your real name Maria Hussein Mohammed Obamma Abimalek, or what? Don’t torture the enemy, but by all means..torture somebody who’s really looking out for you…
July 26th, 2008 at 4:08 pm
For those who listen to Fox beyond pure entertainment are as those reading the Enquirer as the. When I hear O’Reilly and the other whores it is to laugh, never for insight. Besides for the few that had no idea, Fox and the mainstream media are all propagandist.
July 26th, 2008 at 4:09 pm
Brad Snyder…………No my name is exactly what it says it is MARIA. I would like to know who in your opinon is on OUR side ? Who; our Illegal Government and it’s minions controlled by the NWO or is O’Reilly on OUR side ? This illegal administration has said they torture many, many times and it’s no secret, unless it’s only been kept from yourself and O’Reilly (I don’t know), but for all of the rest of us PATRIOTS !!!!!!! we know there is torture. If you want to call yourself American and wave the flag under false pretences, then go right ahead, but stay out of the PATRIOTS way…..we enjoy the truth, we are NOT in denial.
July 26th, 2008 at 4:30 pm
As O’Reilly would say Maria.. IT sounds to me like you are a Leftist Loon. Your definition of torture and mine are quite different. Water boarding is NOT torture. Yet even O’Reilly isn’t for water boarding. I am certainly not for torture that causes permanent bodily harm such as head decapitation or body mutilation of any sort. I would venture to say that it probably has happened, but it is not the policy of the US government to allow such behavior…
This is not the case with the enemies of the United States. It is fact that their forms of punishment are highly inhuman, yet I have never heard the slightest peep from people like you to say one word against them. It’s always America that you show any form of protest. That isn’t the definition of “Patriot”, Ms Hanoi Maria.
July 26th, 2008 at 4:36 pm
Have a bit of pride in your culture, America. Don’t sub-contract out extraordinary rendition followed by torture in some third-world hellhole. Live up to your values: Take torture mainstream on national television as a game show. I see it now: “Take the Waterboard Challenge”. How long can you hold out? America, you are already known as the “The United States of Torture”. Might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb. So grow a moustache, wear a black hat and suck it up. Because you’re the bad guys now. Shocked that nobody loves you any more; best intensions not withstanding? Well, don’t do the crime if you can’t wear the slime.
When Barak Obama becomes president he won’t have much trouble improving America’s image. Face it, it can’t go much lower.
July 26th, 2008 at 4:46 pm
O’Reilly is a F**KING stupid azz PIG! One of the more hateable FREAKS on the planet. Wont to see some of his PIGGEST stuff go look at http://www.onegoodmove.org
July 26th, 2008 at 5:01 pm
I hope I’m on a website here that when the words “When Barak (Mohammed) Obama becomes president…” is invoked…the secondary thoughts of “May Allah help us” comes screaching from your vocal chords, (::short trill:: “Tra-Lalalalalala” and then the customary, “blessed be his name” (amen) resounds… Talk about a major scare directly from the pages of “ConspiracyRUS”!
Good Allah, this man scares the Bajeebees outta me… He is the Man dirctly from and for the New World Order… Anybody check to see if there is a 666 inscribed in his hair line somewhere???
July 26th, 2008 at 5:15 pm
Brad Snyder………..I’m a Leftist loon because you don’t know how to read and only rely on that idiot, moron O’Reilly for your news ? Who the hell told you water boarding is not torture ? Are you insane ? I consider anything as torture that holds someone down and tries to get information without their consent. I don’t know what you call it ? You’re an evil bastard and you should get what you preach.
July 26th, 2008 at 6:04 pm
Maria…Making someone “Feel” like they’re drowning and shoving bamboo sticks under their fingernails are two different things. ONE would cause excruciating pain, the other would not. I know you’re just a girl and don’t understand such things…which is why we should have NEVER allowed you’re hero and fellow fornicator, Slick Willie to let girls in combat…They just don’t have the stomach for it.
I’m NOT a fan of O’Reilly…He’s too Liberal! And George Bush has been a great disappointment… So don’t try to call me a “neocon” or any of the other Liberal names you typically use and try to apply it to me. I simply prefer to be called “Your Highness.” Bastard? Shame on you Maria…such language. Tsk, tsk… And by the way, will you please bake me some chocolate chip cookies?
July 26th, 2008 at 6:33 pm
1: Torture: existence of a specific purpose plus intentional infliction of severe suffering or pain
torture requires the existence of a specific purpose behind the act – to obtain information, for example.
2: Cruel or inhuman treatment: no specific purpose, significant level of suffering or pain inflicted;
3: Outrages upon personal dignity: no specific purpose, significant level of humiliation or degradation.
From the ICRC
=================================================================
As I see it the type/style of severe pain/suffering doesn’t matter. It could entail ripping off finger nails, water boarding, breaking bones, electrocution etc.
If done to obtain information, then its torture.
Now its hard for me to imagine the US government detained, incarcerated, transported thousands of miles and caused great suffering of individuals without the purpose of obtaining some kind of information but hey,,, it could of all been in fun.
Course that would have fallen under category 2 or 3. Much more discussion…………
July 26th, 2008 at 6:37 pm
Brad Snyder………..Like I said, may you get what you preach. Bythe way your kind…..are called NEOCONS, do some research.
July 26th, 2008 at 6:37 pm
Brad Snyder – anyone who uses the word “patriot” is a dangerous idiot, because they have substituted faith and propaganda for intellect and wisdom.
Patriotism and it’s close cousin nationalism were the key feature of the NAZI party. They are gang-like patterns of behaviour which divides the world into “us” and “them”. Destructive and stupid reasoning, and it has blinded you to the realities.
Torture is abhorent, the USA tortures (and not just waterboarding, we have hard evidence of deaths, of electrodes on testicles, of physically torturing children to force their father to admit to crimes, and so on). Brad Snyder, what a failure.
You and your stupid patriotism for the Fatherland, oops, Homeland are why most people outside of the USA are cheering loudly as America sinks into the cesspit.
We’re just patiently waiting for another year or so passes, and the USA becomes the Agentina of the the north (I guess you have no idea about Agentina at the end of the 19th century???).
July 26th, 2008 at 6:49 pm
A British journalist, Peter Hitchens, had the courage and integrity to have himself water boarded to see if it constituted torture or not. After the ordeal he was emphatic that it did. Would it be too much to ask those two American “journalists” to show similar courage and integrity in proving their claim that water boarding is not torture by having it done to themselves – preferably on live TV, so that we can all see how much they enjoy the experience?
By the way, Brad Snyder, you are the kind of person that the phrase “the ugly American” was invented for.
July 26th, 2008 at 7:01 pm
Sorry, I got the left-wing brother (Peter) confused with the right-wing brother (Christopher). Yes, it was the right-wing supporter of the Iraq war, Christopher Hitchens, who allowed himself to be water boarded. An account is given here:
http://www.vanityfair.com/poli.....hens200808
July 26th, 2008 at 7:18 pm
SurferDave.. #1…I NEVER called myself or anyone a Patriot…That would be Maria…. I simply said Maria was NOT a patriot. I guess you meant that little Jab at Maria. Easy on her Dave, she’s just a girl and get’s confused…kinda like you I guess.
I apologize for Dave, Maria… Seriously, I don’t believe you are a “dangerous Idiot”… #2…I am Very proud to be an American! I believe we ARE an independent, sovereign nation who should be FREE from a Big Brother Government, and Big Monopolistic multi-national corporations. “International law” has no power over this country, nor should it ever. We are not the world, we are America..and America should be for Americans FIRST and be the benevolent country that we are for those in need (just like we always have been) But NOT for those who we would consider enemies. For them we should give the same Hell they wish on us.
We do not have to act in accordance to any world governance. If that’s Nationalist, then you betcha… I’m pro Nationalism! Nationalism is Not Nazism…Once again Surfer Dude…you’re confused.
One more thing for Maria, I fully expect that one day soon, the government will break down my doors and try to take away my guns (if I have guns) then haul me and my family off to the “secret” prison camps, and there I’ll be water boarded and who knows what other nasty things they’ll do to me. But that is not THIS government… That will be your government that you’ve elected into this country (via the current Coupe d’état being furtively forced on us as we speak)…Your politicians are the imminent danger to this Nation. By the way, they will come and get you too…Hopefully, I’ll be there to help you, if I’m able.
You see, Maria, Even though I disagree with you, I don’t wish you any ill will. That’s the difference between me and you and the likes of some of the people I’ve read on this message board.
July 26th, 2008 at 7:28 pm
Confused too, huh Ian? No sir, I’m actually quite the stud muffin you wish you were… If you’re talking about Ugly Americans, I think you might actually be thinking of Michael Moore…Now That guy’s quite grotesque…
July 26th, 2008 at 7:29 pm
Brad Snyder………….Please stop freaking talking about me to other people. If they have anything to say to ME they’ll say it. As for your help, you can take it abd shove it. I don’t want help from someone who condones torture no matter how calmly you say it. You don’t have a problem with torturing people and that makes you an evil s.o.b. to me. Can you understand that torturing someone, anyone is wrong !!!!!!!!!!!! Since your such an AMERICAN and not a Patriot, then you should follow The Constitution, I don’t remember it saying water boarding is o.k.
And if you want chocolate chip cookies have your wife or your mother make them for you, you arrogent, chauvinist pig.
Also if ’surferdave’ was talking about me in his ‘patriot’ comment, I would like him to know that I would consider myself a PATRIOT, let’s not forget “The Revolutionary War”…..full of patriots !!!!!!!
July 26th, 2008 at 7:42 pm
Maria… WOooaaah there Bessie… Seriously Sweetheart, I don’t want you stroking out… I would feel just awful if you like…imploaded or something… breath deeply…count to three…easy does it…
Feel better? Good… Ok then…as you wish… When your government hauls you off the their rape rooms, I’ll just let you enjoy your experience…ok? I would never want to offend anyone… You can have it your way…
July 26th, 2008 at 7:57 pm
I wasn’t referring to your doubtless Neanderthal appearance, Brad Snyder, but rather to the ugliness of your soul (assuming you have one).
July 26th, 2008 at 8:02 pm
“Stud muffin”? This guy has been stuck out in the backwoods somewhere since the 1970s.
July 26th, 2008 at 8:13 pm
Seriously, let’s face it, we are not going to stop torture, so let’s be for torture, provided it be a public spectacle, else it is wasted, wasted when done in a soundproof blood spattered dungeon. Right ?
But it must be on Fox Prime Time TV News complete with the unearthly unceasing screams of the wracked, and the satanic demented shrieks of rapture from the torturers – and their enablers, Bill O’Reilly and Laura Ingraham, who are no different.
What a fine rhapsodical medley all that would be, and my cheeks flush with anticipation, for soon the western world will be more free of terruhrists !
Then Bill and Laura and torturers can form a panel discussion on the finer points of how to extract max info for minimum pain.
How humane ! Recall the `Humanitarian Bombings` over Yugoslavia in 1999, the term coined by one Jamie, the NATO spokesman ?
No Pain, No Gain is the shingle over the doorway ! Yeehaa !
Imagine the ratings ! Sell it as Torture, Torture, all the time only on Fox and Affiliates Nightly at Seven!
Then, and only then, would stunned Americans, 100,000,000 of them, quietly, and as one, wordlessly, pick up their guns and go to Washington.
July 26th, 2008 at 8:40 pm
There are a lot of things that amaze me.. and one of the things is that people like You single out Fox for your hatred…Yet the other networks are WAY over-the-line predispositioned to lies and biased commentary. They don’t report…They make it up if it follows the Liberal, Socialist, and Communist agenda that you all love so dearly. Seriously people…O’Reilly is on your side… He is against water boarding…He doesn’t want torture… He’s just sick and tired of your whining that America is the evil empire that tortures people… I agree and disagreed with him.. Water boarding is NOT torture… and America doesn’t torture, and when the few are caught that do torture, they are punished, as they should be!
The torture here is coming from your mouths (err keyboards)… Stop your whining and get your facts right!
Ian, you have it right, I definitely was a teenager from the 70s and my lingo may be out dated… what are they saying today??? I believe, and correct me if I’m wrong, that the saying should be… that “I’m all that!” Is that any better? Still son, the fact is that women want me, and men want to be me, and my soul has been washed white as snow for the Bible tells me so.
Back to Maria… My wife makes those slice and bake Chocolate chip cookies… I hate them really.. and her cooking.. Ohhh My gosh….talk about torture…
July 26th, 2008 at 9:09 pm
Brad Snyder………..I think this guy is totaly obsessed with me. And he doesn’t seem to understand that water boarding is torture, that the American Government does torture, that the people who “get caught” are only the low ranking minions that get punished and are only punished for our eyes only and that whoever condones torture IN ANY WAY is not in any way a Christian, hence your soul is not as white as snow and that means the bible does not tell you so. Everyone here is against the NWO that’s controlling this government and it seems like your the only one here with the classic “double speak” of the NWO. And let’s not forget about your over inflated ego.
(And my damn cookies are from scratch)
July 26th, 2008 at 9:11 pm
Brad—of the COUNTLESS stupid things you have said—this has got to take the cake: “Luke and really..the rest of you…Before we were ever accused of “torture”..I recall Fox reporting a number of beheadings; or have you forgotten. I’m quite certain the Bush haters among you would say”
My very first post to you I posted an article that PROVED detainees were tortured—and not only did you say you have a “high level of research”—you obviously did not read my post. The detainees that have been tortured have NOT, I REPEAT, have NOT been charged with any crimes——so what Earthly point are you making in your above quote I posted where you compare the UNCHARGED detainees to terrorists who behead people??? Youre not a fan of O Reilly? My God, you SOUND like him when you make statements like that!
July 26th, 2008 at 9:13 pm
Brad: “Larry, if we were NOT treating enemy combatants with a high level of discomfort I would wonder why not”—–”high level of discomfort”? Oh, in other words—-TORTURE. Brad, you might want to read the Geneva Conventions!
July 26th, 2008 at 9:24 pm
Brad: “Maria, Maria… Careful there sweetheart…Don’t want you to burst a blood vessel, causing a nose bleed or…something. You people simply amaze me… Sticking up for the enemy…defending them… And you wonder why we call you Un-American? Is your real name Maria Hussein Mohammed Obamma Abimalek, or what? Don’t torture the enemy, but by all means..torture somebody who’s really looking out for you…”
Brad claims he does “research”, but he hasnt researched enough to know that there were ZERO terrorists in Iraq before we INVADED them and Iraq had NOTHING to do with 9-11. I simply despise people who after FIVE years of this unconstitutional war, STILL sound the trumpet that 9-11 and Iraq had a connection. Brad, since you “claim” to research, I suggest you read Vincent Bugliosi’s new book “The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder” and read his UNBIASED and LEGAL explanation of why Bush is LEGALLY responsible for over 4,000 deaths of our troops and as many as 1 million deaths of Iraqi citizens. And here you are calling Maria names and calling Iraq the “enemy”, as if they had ANYTHING to do with 9-11. Did you research enough to know that just 6 days before Bush went on national TV and LIED to America and said Saddam Hussein was a threat to America, he received an NIE report from his own CIA detailing that ALL 16 intelligence agencies in Washington said that Saddam was NOT a threat!
But you hate FACTS dont you? Oh, and Maria, I think Im in love with you. I hate O Reilly too. Go to my site and see how much I hate him. Scroll down the right hand sign and under my labels section click the Bill O Reilly label and read my stories on him
http://www.realtruthonline.blogspot.com
July 26th, 2008 at 9:26 pm
Actually Maria, I don’t think that any real woman could put up with being around him for more than ten seconds, so he is probably suffering from a rather unsatifying relationship with a blow up doll (or, maybe if he is a country boy, it is sheep).
July 26th, 2008 at 9:34 pm
Thank you Larry and Ian………..lolololol
July 26th, 2008 at 9:37 pm
Brad, if we were in a swimming pool and I grabbed your head and dunked it under the water and held you there until you almost drowned and then I pulled you up again until you got some air and then immediately dunked you again and kept repeating that, would that NOT be torture? Huh???
Well, guess what??? I jsut described WATERBOARDING! My God, even the scumbag Christopher Hitchens agrees its torture!
If its NOT torture as you say Brad, will you call Alex Jones on Monday and have him call a military official and have them arrange a waterboarding session for you? Of course, you will chicken out…you Neo-cons usually do.
Youre for the war too and you refuse to enlist!
July 26th, 2008 at 9:38 pm
Maria, please check out my site and check out my O Reilly (under labels) stories. I would really like your reaction
July 26th, 2008 at 9:47 pm
LARRY……….I did visit your site, it’s fantastic. You got great info on there. Really good job. I’m posting your link to MySpace.
July 26th, 2008 at 9:56 pm
Thanks Maria, it means alot coming from a fellow O Reilly hater. Id like to see your myspace page if you feel comfortable showing me, but I understand if you dont want to post the link here. Post it under the comments section under my most recent story on my site and after I see it, I will delete that post.
July 26th, 2008 at 10:08 pm
Larry…….I have no problem posting it: myspace.com/nmaria09
July 26th, 2008 at 10:09 pm
Maria, my last comment didnt show up—-can I have the link to your myspace page? send the link to my most recent story on my site (under comments), I will delete it after i see it
July 26th, 2008 at 10:13 pm
Maria, you are right… I’m obsessed..You seem to be a spunky ol’ gal. From scratch…REALLY? How do you feel about on-line relationships?
There is not much that separates me from the rest of you on this website relating to this topic. The definition of torture about sums it up…
As far as “detainees” are concerned… You want to treat them as prisoners in our penal system. I would not be for ANY form of abuse to anyone in our prisons. (But, I don’t think they should have televisions either. I don’t know, you might consider that cruel and unusual punishment too.)
Guantanamo is not a prison for Americans. Most of the “detainees” have been captured in the line of combat. They want to kill our soldiers…and you…They hate the West. They think we are the great Satan. They are not entitled to have their day in a U.S. court. A military tribunal? Yes… I don’t want to “torture them for the sake of cruelty, but if we can get vital information that would be benefitial to the security of our country, then I truly believe it is necessary.
July 26th, 2008 at 10:22 pm
Maria, I need you to add me on myspace, I tried sending an email but I have to be a friend first
July 26th, 2008 at 10:27 pm
Brad, I kind of figured you would completely IGNORE my last few posts—–especially the Vincent Bugliosi stuff. Thats what you Neo-cons do when faced with facts you cant refute, you simply ignore it and pretend you didnt see it
July 26th, 2008 at 10:31 pm
Brad Snyder……..You still fail to understand the whole point here…the detainees in Guantanamo are not enemy combatants. They have NO INFO, this illegal government never got any info from anyone in there. The whole point here is that this government is not our government, it’s not run “By the people for the people”, it’s run by the NWO and their minions. Anything you defend about this illegal government only shows that you are part of it. You can’t pick and choose sections of something rotten, either the whole thing is garbage or the whole thing is not garbage. Pick the right side.
July 26th, 2008 at 10:39 pm
Larry…..I added you, try again.
July 26th, 2008 at 10:46 pm
Larry, I really have to say that you REALLY are full of crap! No terrorist in Iraq before we went in? Damn boy…you are the one that REALLY doesn’t read! There is plenty of proof that they were there… Maybe not the ones that flew planes into the towers… but they were there. This was a war on terror and Iraq was definitely a terrorist state. Hussein was definitely connected to the first WTC bombing… There’s plenty more to say on this topic, but … Whatever, you’re still say this is an illegal war and Bush is a War Criminal. yeah, yeah… I heard you…
If you want to blame somebody for this war…I suggest the French and Germans and Russians…or the UnNeeded Nations They could have taken a stronger stand against Hussein who was really taunting us…rattling his saber, But I know.. He was a good guy too… and those damn French and Russians and Germans… Don’t you wish you could be European? It’s America who should be ashamed.. Pure and simple evil I tell you!
It seems to me that most of you have a left leaning…If I’m not mistaken, you buy into the “Right-wing conspiracy” bull-crap spouted By Mrs Bill. If you’re more afraid of the Right than you are the Left, you are WAY off your rocker, and there’s not much hope for any of you. Please, please correct me if I’m wrong.
July 26th, 2008 at 11:03 pm
Ok, so Brad, are you saying we went to Iraq just because there were terrorists there period? Or did we go because we were LIED to and told that Saddam was going to NUKE us if we didnt get HIM first? So, after 9-11, our mission was to go just ANYWHERE in the world where terrorists were? Why arent we in Saudi Arabia invading them? 15 of the 19 hijackers were Saudis! Do you know whats amazing about you Neo-cons? Bush announced after 9-11 that Iran, Iraq and North Korea were the “Axis of Evil”, yet we have ONLY invaded (of the 3) Iraq. Isnt it amazing that the ONLY country of the 3 that HAS nukes (North Korea), we not only DID NOT attack, but Bush just recently REMOVED them from the terror list!!! Gee, I wonder if why the ONLY reason that he keeps Iraq and Iran ON the list is because Iran and Iraq are the ONLY ones of the 3 that have an abundance of OIL! North Korea has no oil.
Interesting, isnt it? I also noticed that you couldnt refute ONE WORD of the Vincent Bugliosi stuff I said. Know why? Because Bugliosi speaks on everything on LEGAL terms, not political terms. And what I meant to say is that there was no AL QAEDA in Iraq—-not “no terrorists”. It was “al Qaeda” that supposedly attacked us on 9-11, right? But there was NO al Qaeda in Iraq before we invaded, that is FACT. Hell, there’s terrorists EVERYWHERE. There’s terrorists HERE in the USA—–why dont invade OURSELVES?
I also noticed you completely IGNORED my waterboarding comment too about me dunking your head. I guess you couldnt refute that. (I knew you couldnt)
Tell me something Brad—-if you are sitting in your house watching TV and you hear a big explosion outside and look out the window and its bombs going off, then you walk outside and discover we are being attacked by Canadians, do you LET them attack you and kill you? Or do you go grab your gun and kill them for INVADING our country? You LOVE America, right? You LOVE this country, right? So, you must defend it right? Im sure you’d say yes. If you killed the Canadians, would you be a hero for defending your country, or would you rather be called an insurgent or a terrorist?
Tell me something Brad, why are people who kill Americans in Iraq called insurgents and terrorists for defending their country that WE invaded? Hmmmm?? have an answer???
July 26th, 2008 at 11:04 pm
Brad Snyder……..Again you just don’t understand. There IS NO left or right, they are the same. You have only been tricked into thinking there’s a difference. There is only a New World Order. There is only the Illuminati/ The Ellite that are in charge. Our government is their puppets. DO YOU UNDERSTAND. Our government is told what to do by THEM. There are no Democrats or Republicans.
I don’t understand something, you are commenting on this site ? have you even looked at the information Alex Jones has kindly provided for you. Have you researched anything here ? Maybe you should take a closer look.
July 26th, 2008 at 11:26 pm
I’ve come to this website (and this is my first day) because I’ve been told that Alex Jones was a great guy and I should check him out…I actually have never heard of him prior. well I’m checking him out… I’m not quite there…ready to admit this government blew up the WTC on 911. If you accepted this without any hesitation, then you really do want to believe the worst, and I believe that’s unforgivable. Not everything you read is truth…there’s pleanty of BS (note my initials) out there, so who are you going to believe???
Although, I’m not with you there… yet…I do NOT like George Bush on practically everything he has done… with the EXCEPTION… I felt he was a strong leader…and I believed he was right-on with this war on terror. Somebody HAD to do something about these Islamofacist terrorist. It seemed they were Hell bent on provoking us…You can’t deny it IS their wish to turn everything… Muslim… If you haven’t read the Koran, I challenge you to read it. If you believe it was the Crusaders in Europe who were the bad guys, you really don’t know your history…or…You’re believing a lie about what actually happened. These people truly ARE a threat to our welfare.
That said…I believe Bush, with his Globalist stance is at least naive…and at worst…a very scary person who is capable of doing what you say… I’m wanting to think he’s Naive…because honestly I just don’t want to believe otherwise. (and I’m being honest) I find it difficult and painful to think this current government is anything other than what I think it is. But I’m not far behind you… I believe there’s a NWO/Illuminati force in this world and it’s coming at us quickly..
I don’t follow the Republican party either…They’re made up of weak, spineless politicians but I vote for them because they are the “lessor of two evils”, which I really hate doing… Where is the one conservative that will lead us??? I haven’t found him yet.
Larry, honestly, I’m not trying to ignore the information you sent me… There’s a ton of material to read, and when I see some of the type of…garbage out there… I have to question the source. CNN don’t impress me much… and…as you’ve seen from the many posts I’ve made… I was in a writing mode today..not reading… I appreciate the moderator of this website indulging me. and Larry,I will look at your material. So you see, in spite of my love of pissing people off, I’m really a decent guy trying to find his way…
July 26th, 2008 at 11:34 pm
After reading your last comments Larry, I DO have answers for you…do you really want me to answer? And should I continue monopolizing this message board??? NOT what I’m trying to do. If you want to have a private discussion I’ll be happy to do so in a private email – Although I hesitate giving my email on this message board.
July 26th, 2008 at 11:39 pm
You’re wrong Snider and torture is wrong.By not participating in it,it separates us from the rest of the uncivilized world.Taking pliers to a childs testicles in front of his parents to make them talk is evil and sadistic.You should have to endure such treatment.Mister big talking big shit hiding behind a computer.Karma will straighten you out one day.
July 26th, 2008 at 11:46 pm
I didnt except 9-11 being an inside job easy Brad. I was fooled like everyone else for 3 years and I woke up from my slumber in 2004. Brad, there are no Islamofascists—-thats a bullshit FOX News-invented term. We were provoked???? Are you kidding me? We made it our business for 100 years to get in everyones business and be the worlds policemen. The Constitution instructs us NOT to be involved in foreign entanglements and we IGNORED it—and it has come and bit us in the ass…now as a response to terror, Bush wants to ignore the Constitution more, claiming we have to “give up our rights” to fight terror. We are in this mess to begin with because we have IGNORED the Constitution.
Email me on my site:
http://www.realtruthonline.blogspot.com
You will see on my site I am not right or left wing—–I am after the truth—-and I post evidence to support what I say
July 26th, 2008 at 11:49 pm
Brad Snyder……..Well I’m sorry to disapoint you Brad but the horrible truth is that 9/11 WAS an inside job and actually I knew this the day it happned. I live in NY so I was front row center and when I went home and turned on the TV (around 7:00 – 8:00 pm) and I saw that only a few hours after this tragedy happened, that they had all the 19 terrorists, names, addresses etc…. I knew it that very moment….I told everybody and they all thought I was crazy. How can our government know this info (with pictures of these guys) only a few hours after it happened. but yet 7 years latter have NO clue to where Bin Ladden is ? Please watch “Loose Change” or some of Alex Jones videos, you can Google them. The proof is out there, you won’t see it on CNN or MSNBC or FoxNews or any of them, they are ALL ownned by the NWO/Illuminatti. Newspapers, magazines and TV are all garbage. The Internet is our only hope for truth in News. If you want to vote for real change, then I suggest voting for an IDEPENDENT. That’s our only hope.
July 26th, 2008 at 11:56 pm
i meant “accept 9-11…” not “except”—sorry Im tired
July 26th, 2008 at 11:59 pm
Amen, Maria. I give away DVD’s for free—-despite FOX News claiming we are in this “for profit”—lol
July 27th, 2008 at 12:05 am
fido…Never once did I say I think pliars to children’s testicles is what should happen… I mean.. I don’t think I said that, did I Maria? I think I would only consider that reasonable in fido’s case fido. My definition of torture is different from yours…Quit using extreme examples and say I want to torture people. I don’t…
July 27th, 2008 at 12:07 am
Brad Snyder………..No you never said to take pliars to a child. You said that you thought water boarding is NOT torture.
July 27th, 2008 at 12:14 am
Brad, are you going to call Alex Jones on Monday and get him to get a military guy to set up a waterboarding session for you so you can test if its torture? Whats your answer on that? Yes: you will call Alex? or No: you wont?
what will it be?
July 27th, 2008 at 12:39 am
Larry, The Islamofacist term may very well be a made up term, but I STRONGLY disagree that they don’t exist or they’re not a threat. If anyone is in league with your NWO, it’s these Nations of Islam…I’ll add to that the European Union and Vladamir Putin, he’s a pretty bag guy isn’t he? You buy into the collapse of communist Russia? I don’t… Communism is pretty evil…. isn’t it?
I don’t know how you feel about Israel… I separate the nation of Israel from Zionist. I don’t believe “Zionists” are real Jews, although some of them are.
Maria, I’m sorry, but I just can’t be there with you…like I said…”yet”. There’s plenty that doesn’t make sense, but believing because somebody wrote it or..says so is not good enough for me… Proof can be doctored…I’ve seen the video of the “fighter jet” not “airline” that crashed into the Pentagon. No, I’m sorry…BS! It’s about as clear as the video of Big Foot…Then again, maybe you believe in Big Foot too, huh?
I REALLY would like to know who else you blame other than Bush, Chaney, Fox News and America… Surely you guys have something more to give me than Blaming the American Government first… Is this government the only evil ones in your eyes?
I concede the fact that something is seriously, seriously wrong the Republican Party. These people are not what they’re supposed to be. I agree with you Maria, there is no difference between Republicans and Democrats..anymore. But there’s a HUGE difference between Conservatives and Liberals….HUGE! Am I wasting my time here? Are you people more Liberal than Conservative? If you’re Liberal, I’ll be happy to be on my merry way, in search of something else that makes better sense to me.
July 27th, 2008 at 12:43 am
Larry, if I’ve done something wrong in the eyes of this government…by all means water board me if you can catch me… I’d MUCH rather be caught by this government than say… Iran or Syria or possibly the people of MoveOn.Org….
July 27th, 2008 at 1:14 am
Hey larry…You rock on! It took me up until 2006.5(lol). Your absolutely right, this is a game they are playing and I hope every one of them involved one day are indited for this monstrosity they have created. God Bless !
July 27th, 2008 at 1:46 am
O’Reilly’s and Ingraham’s theatrics and semantic gamesmanship aside, in “Memos show Bush administration sanctioned torture,” by Tom Ely, 26 July 2008 on
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2.....-j26.shtml, we can note the following sad and sorry facts:
“a human rights organization that shared the Nobel Peace Prize in 1997 for its work in combat zones, Physicians for Human Rights, called for an investigation into torture and war crimes by US government officials. Allen Keller, a spokesman for the group, testified Thursday before a US House of Representatives hearing about the treatment of prisoners at Guantanamo Bay, as well as in Iraq and Afghanistan.
PHR has recently issued a study entitled, “Broken Laws, Broken Lives: Medical evidence of torture by US personnel and its impact,” with a preface by retired US Army General Antonio Teguba, who conducted the first official investigation into the abuse of prisoners at Abu Ghraib. Teguba wrote in the preface that there was “no longer any doubt that the current administration has committed war crimes. The only question that remains to be answered is whether those who ordered the use of torture will be held to account.”
July 27th, 2008 at 6:06 am
Brad Snyder wrote: This was a war on terror and Iraq was definitely a terrorist state. Hussein was definitely connected to the first WTC bombing…
Brad, Saddam Hussein was an American pawn. He was seen in the past by the U.S. as a bulwark of anti-communism in the 60’s, and as a counterweight to Iran in the 80’s. They used him as their instrument for more than 40 years. Saddam’s first contacts with U.S. officials date back to 1959, when he was part of a CIA-authorized six-man squad tasked with assassinating then Iraqi Prime Minister Abdul Karim Qassim.
According to Said Aburish, Saddam made a visit to Amman in the year 1979, before the Iran-Iraq war, where he met three senior CIA agents. He discussed with them his plans to invade Iran.
In 1980, Iraq started the war with a blitzkrieg attack, the tide had turned by 1982 in favor of much larger Iran, and the Ronald Reagan administration was afraid Iraq might lose. Reagan chose Donald Rumsfeld as his emissary to Saddam, whom he visited in December 1983 and March 1984.
After the visit, the Reagan administration offered Hussein financial credits that eventually made Iraq the third-largest recipient of US assistance. The CIA and DIA relation with Saddam intensified. The CIA regularly sent a team to Saddam to deliver battlefield intelligence obtained from Saudi AWACS surveillance aircraft, Iraq used this information to target Iranian troops with chemical weapons.
Under President George H.W. Bush, the U.S. doubled its financial credits for Iraq. Dick Cheney, who was secretary of defense and a statutory member of the National Security Council that reviewed Iraq policy, supported the administration’s appeasement policy
Brad, The Bush administration made plans for war and for Iraq’s oil before the 9/11 attacks. Insiders told that planning began “within weeks” of Bush’s first taking office in 2001, long before the September 11th attack on the US.
The industry-favoured plan was pushed aside by a secret plan, drafted just before the invasion in 2003, which called for the sell-off of all of Iraq’s oil fields. The new plan was crafted by neo-conservatives intent on using Iraq’s oil to destroy the Opec cartel through massive increases in production above Opec quotas.
Mr Aljibury, once Ronald Reagan’s “back-channel” to Saddam, claims that plans to sell off Iraq’s oil, pushed by the US-installed Governing Council in 2003, helped instigate the insurgency and attacks on US and British occupying forces.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/pro.....354269.stm
July 27th, 2008 at 6:31 am
Brad, some more thing that you conveniently do not want to know…
Fifteen of the 9/11 hijackers obtained their visas in Saudi Arabia. Michael Springman, the former head of the American visa bureau in Jeddah, has stated that since 1987 the CIA had been illicitly issuing visas to unqualified applicants from the Middle East and bringing them to the US for training in terrorism for the Afghan war in collaboration with Bin Laden (BBC, November 6 2001). It seems this operation continued after the Afghan war for other purposes. It is also reported that five of the hijackers received training at secure US military installations in the 1990s (Newsweek, September 15 2001).
All of this makes it all the more astonishing – on the war on terrorism perspective – that there was such slow reaction on September 11 itself. The first hijacking was suspected at not later than 8.20am, and the last hijacked aircraft crashed in Pennsylvania at 10.06am. Not a single fighter plane was scrambled to investigate from the US Andrews airforce base, just 10 miles from Washington DC, until after the third plane had hit the Pentagon at 9.38 am. Why not? There were standard FAA intercept procedures for hijacked aircraft before 9/11. Between September 2000 and June 2001 the US military launched fighter aircraft on 67 occasions to chase suspicious aircraft (AP, August 13 2002). It is a US legal requirement that once an aircraft has moved significantly off its flight plan, fighter planes are sent up to investigate.
Nor is the US response after 9/11 any better. No serious attempt has ever been made to catch Bin Laden. In late September and early October 2001, leaders of Pakistan’s two Islamist parties negotiated Bin Laden’s extradition to Pakistan to stand trial for 9/11. However, a US official said, significantly, that “casting our objectives too narrowly” risked “a premature collapse of the international effort if by some lucky chance Mr Bin Laden was captured”. The US chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, General Myers, went so far as to say that “the goal has never been to get Bin Laden” (AP, April 5 2002). The whistleblowing FBI agent Robert Wright told ABC News (December 19 2002) that FBI headquarters wanted no arrests. And in November 2001 the US airforce complained it had had al-Qaida and Taliban leaders in its sights as many as 10 times over the previous six weeks, but had been unable to attack because they did not receive permission quickly enough (Time Magazine, May 13 2002). None of this assembled evidence, all of which comes from sources already in the public domain, is compatible with the idea of a real, determined war on terrorism.
The catalogue of evidence does, however, fall into place when set against the PNAC blueprint. From this it seems that the so-called “war on terrorism” is being used largely as bogus cover for achieving wider US strategic geopolitical objectives. Indeed Tony Blair himself hinted at this when he said to the Commons liaison committee: “To be truthful about it, there was no way we could have got the public consent to have suddenly launched a campaign on Afghanistan but for what happened on September 11″ (Times, July 17 2002). Similarly Rumsfeld was so determined to obtain a rationale for an attack on Iraq that on 10 separate occasions he asked the CIA to find evidence linking Iraq to 9/11; the CIA repeatedly came back empty-handed (Time Magazine, May 13 2002).
In fact, 9/11 offered an extremely convenient pretext to put the PNAC plan into action. The evidence again is quite clear that plans for military action against Afghanistan and Iraq were in hand well before 9/11. A report prepared for the US government from the Baker Institute of Public Policy stated in April 2001 that “the US remains a prisoner of its energy dilemma. Iraq remains a destabilising influence to… the flow of oil to international markets from the Middle East”. Submitted to Vice-President Cheney’s energy task group, the report recommended that because this was an unacceptable risk to the US, “military intervention” was necessary (Sunday Herald, October 6 2002).
Similar evidence exists in regard to Afghanistan. The BBC reported (September 18 2001) that Niaz Niak, a former Pakistan foreign secretary, was told by senior American officials at a meeting in Berlin in mid-July 2001 that “military action against Afghanistan would go ahead by the middle of October”. Until July 2001 the US government saw the Taliban regime as a source of stability in Central Asia that would enable the construction of hydrocarbon pipelines from the oil and gas fields in Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan, through Afghanistan and Pakistan, to the Indian Ocean. But, confronted with the Taliban’s refusal to accept US conditions, the US representatives told them “either you accept our offer of a carpet of gold, or we bury you under a carpet of bombs” (Inter Press Service, November 15 2001).
July 27th, 2008 at 8:20 am
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1V5iCUBEUx4
you dont have to accept this-
GS
July 27th, 2008 at 8:26 am
I did watch the “loose Change” videos…Gotta say, How one can draw a conclusion from what is being surmised from THOSE videos, makes your claims even MORE far fetched. I’m LOOKING for answers, and they’re simply not there. IF you have an anti-Bush view BEFORE 911 then you can draw from your own biases that your “proof” is satisfactory. That’s it…
Larry, because we set Hussein up, and I agree that the US did prop his power base in years past, doesn’t mean that he was a great ally that could be trusted. He proved himself unworthy of trust in the 90s and into this new millennium. He WAS uncooperative with his every word and action. Yes he was in power and it was our fault! He USED chemical weapons on his own countrymen. He did NOT allow inspectors the freedom to investigate where they wanted to go. Iraq shot at our military time and again after they lost the first war.
There is plenty of evidence that proves Iraq was behind the first WTC bombings, which you seem to want to give him a pass on. He supported and protected terrorists and allowed them into his country. He offered rewards to the families of suicide bombers.
Maria, just because they had the names of the terrorists on the planes that were hijacked “hours” after the bombing doesn’t suprise me at all…not in the least bit…
EVERY airline knows exactly….exactly…. who their passengers are. They would have name, address, phone number, credit card information, from there they would be able to pull up driver’s license/passport pictures easily accessible in data bases. Your conclusion that it must have been an “inside job” just holds no water. I believe you didn’t like Bush before and this simply adds fuel to your hatred of him now.
I believe you were Liberal before because you haven’t answered my questions about your previous leanings.
Eventually, we will be together, because Allah forbid, Barrak Mohammad Obamma will more than likely be our next president. I’m less than enthused about his opposition. Mohammad Obamma will probably usher in the NWO (thanks to powers, Bush reserved for this fight against terror). Those powers in the right hands protect our freedoms. Those powers in the hands of somebody like Mohammad Obamma sends shivers up my spine. In short, we are all screwed.
Do what you must to protect yourselves..but beware…”change is coming”…You voted for it…You have nobody to blame except yourselves. Please hold your ridiculous name calling: Bushie sheeple, neocon, or what ever the “new thing” is… simply doesn’t fit with me! Honestly friends…I want to believe you…The evidence is not there for me…I’m sorry.
I can still be convinced..I believe Bush is somewhat in league with the NWO/Illuminati (Open borders, bankruptcy protection for BANKS…NAFTA, CAFTA, my list goes on and on and on…) I’m not FAR from admitting that he’s a bad guy too. For now, I think he’s being manipulated as a puppet unwillingly. I believe he sold us out…I just cant bring myself to believe BUSH…is responsible for bringing down those towers.
HOWEVER…I believe the likes of Rockerfeller, Astor, Collins, DuPont, Freeman, Kennedy, Li, Onassis, Reynolds, Rothschilds, Russell, Van Duyn…add to that list Soros, Brzezinski, Niederhoffer, among others… You tell me these guys are responsible, and then, I can believe that it’s plausible, but Bush? No….
July 27th, 2008 at 9:44 am
Brad wrote: That said…I believe Bush, with his Globalist stance is at least naive…and at worst…a very scary person who is capable of doing what you say… I’m wanting to think he’s Naive…because honestly I just don’t want to believe otherwise. (and I’m being honest) I find it difficult and painful to think this current government is anything other than what I think it is. But I’m not far behind you… I believe there’s a NWO/Illuminati force in this world and it’s coming at us quickly..
First off and to Brad’s defense on his thoughts of LooseChange…IMHO they have an agenda and the videos leave much to be desired.
Second, wanting to think someone is naive because “…just don’t want to think otherwise (and I’m being honest)” as Brad states is quite naive.
In Brad’s paragraph above, he states 1) what he wants to believe, 2) what he believes to be another possible truth (”…a very scary person capable of doing what you say.”), 3) “I find it difficult and painful to think this current government is anything other than what I think it is.”, AND 4) “I believe there’s a NWO/Illuminati force in this world and it’s coming at us quickly.”.
To be quite frank and in all fairness to Brad – it sounds to me that he has absolutely no idea what he thinks or believes. I give him much credit for his attempts (he did mention this was the first time at PP) and I will not assume (as some might) that he has not done other research besides LooseChange and so I would say he’s on the right path.
Brad’s comments are not unique and should not be taken as being off the wall or against the truth movement. Another person here mentioned “when in Rome do as the Romans” in context to how one goes about portraying (their version) of the truth to others. Simply put, subtlety. On the other hand brute force methods (as many “truthers” seem to believe in) only work in limited instances, cost very much effort, and require less thought for a solution. All of these things are detrimental to the pursuit of truth.
July 27th, 2008 at 10:01 am
NO offence BRAD but all one has to do is watch the many videos of WTC# 7 to know our government did 911. You can choose not to believe and not trust your lieing eyes, but that all the evidence I needed. YEA YEA YEA a deasle fire brought it down blah blah blah. Yes right! I watch all that live and I say a much more damning video of 7 coming down that I have not seen since. It was a camera on the street right at WTC#7 and you could clearly see explosions popping out the sides as it started to fall… I have never seen any recording of that shot. BUSH’s own brother was incharge if security of the WTC complex and his contract expired on 911.
July 27th, 2008 at 10:19 am
Brad: “Larry, if I’ve done something wrong in the eyes of this government…by all means water board me if you can catch me… I’d MUCH rather be caught by this government than say… Iran or Syria or possibly the people”
Nice try Brad, but I didnt say “If youve done something wrong and they waterboard you for a crime…”. I said “go have yourself be waterboarded and come back and tell us if you think it’s torture” You never did address my comment about whether you’d let me keep dunking your head under water. I love how you pick and choose what you respond to, and when you DO respond to it, you twist it around, like the above waterboarding comment that I quoted from you.
Luke—-Amen brother! You are 100% CORRECT about Saddam Hussein. Like Phil Donahue said to BIllo the Clown—-he was a bastrd, yes, but he was OUR bastard! Osama bin Laden is also OURS, a CIA operative who had a CIA name, Tim Osman.
Oh, and Brad, keep in mind one thing concerning 9-11. We (the revisionists dont have to be right about EVERY issue concerning 9-11, because if we are right about, say…10 out of 50 issues, the officical story crumbles. But the official story has to be right on EVERY SINGLE issue, or their story crumbles. And trust me, they have been wrong on MANY issues! So, when you watch videos like Loose Change, keep in mind, we dont have to be right on every single thing, but THEY (the official story people) do.
Oh, and Brad, you never answered why we arent attacking Saudi Arabia and you never addressed my comment about if Canadians attacking us—what would you do?
July 27th, 2008 at 10:28 am
If Iraqis fight a war of defense subsequently capture U.S. troops, and treat them only half as bad as the U.S. treats captured combatants, or even civilians who are not captured, would O’Reilly, Ingraham and all the other nay sayers then think it’s torture? 5pillar.wordpress.com
July 27th, 2008 at 10:40 am
I guess I need to quote that great American Saint, that pillar of moral philosophy and theology, that walking crime-wave Rodney King; “Can, can we all just get along?”
July 27th, 2008 at 5:46 pm
for the truth go to ( real jew news website)
July 27th, 2008 at 7:59 pm
Larry, I’m not ducking your questions…I’m just not in the mood. I have really good answers for you too… Maybe another time? I’m really here to have MY questions answered and you haven’t answered me either… so I guess that makes us even…
July 28th, 2008 at 12:09 am
Brad, the ONLY questions I see from you that you have asked me personally are hypothetical ones, not ACTUAL ones where you really want an answer to. Is the reason you wont answer MY questions is because you HAVE no answer?? Yes, I think that’s why!
July 28th, 2008 at 7:25 am
Seems the disinfo/distraction agents are out in full force at PP.